Alex, Bill or other GPS-savvy riders, perhaps you could post some GPS recommendations for those of us considering taking the plunge?

I wrote this awhile back to the LDRider list. The prices might be a bit cheaper now, but the rest of the info should still be reasonably current...

Message: 11
Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 20:07:24 -0700
From: Alex Ciurczak <XXX@XXXX.com>
Subject: [LDRider] Re: 276C vs. 2610
To: LDRider@ibdone.org
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20040920190937.02239ec0@mail.spamcop.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

I've been playing with GPS units ever since they got pretty cheap about 5
years ago, and have had them on a motorcycle at the same time. I've had 4
different types of devices, and 5 total units so far, and loved 'em all as
each successive one got more feature-rich and useful. 2 years ago I
thought it would be 5-10 years before one could buy a handheld color GPS
with auto-routing for a smidge over $300, since they were well over $1200
at the time; but just 2 years later we're already there.

Both the 276C and the 2610 appear to be great devices. But if you want one
device that's about half the cost, significantly smaller, 1/3 - 1/2 the
weight, fits into a bike's cockpit much easier, and can be used as a
battery-powered handheld for hiking, using on planes, etc, I'd recommend
taking a peek at the Garmin 60C/60CS, or the 76C/76CS. I've had the 60C
for a few months now, used it very successfully on one 24-hour rally, along
with it working flawlessly on every other ride before and since. It is
rubberized all over the bottom, sides, and antenna, and I've dropped it
onto pavement from a couple feet up and it survives just fine. The
processors are plenty fast, the screens are stellar (with backlight on),
and the buttons are solid. We liked it so much I bought another one so my
wife and I have twin 60C's when we ride separately (and it's always good to
have a spare if someone is traveling). I use it on commercial aircraft all
the time; it's incredibly neat (to me) to know as much as the pilot about
how fast you're traveling, what elevation, where you are, and when the
plane is expected to land.

The potentially fatal flaw for these units is the lack of memory
expandability. The 60C series comes with 56 megs, and the 76C series has
115 megs. Keep in mind that all of these units come with a full USA
basemap that can route you to any town there is, without using any of that
memory, but for detailed routing around back roads, you do have to load up
the data from either the newer CitySelect data or the older Metroguide
(version 4). The routing is spot-on, and we've had fun comparing it to the
directions provided by our in-car nav systems. 99% of the time, they
mirror eachother, with the only issues being in very tight cities, or under
long bridges, the inc-car system can start to rely on its inertial
navigation when the GPS signals get too weak temporarily. Here in CA, I
can have the maps loaded from LA to Eureka in the unit, going as far east
as Las Vegas, so the detailed area you can fit in 56 megs is reasonably
generous. If it is a base requirement to be able to load up half the US at
one time to route to specific addresses and not just towns, the more
expensive units (+ some pricey memory cards) would be a better choice.

The 60C goes for $355 at gpsnow.com, the autonav kit (CitySelect software,
cigarette power adapter, auto mount, portable non-stick mount) goes for
$160. $25 for a barewire power cable to hook up directly to the bike's
electrics (60C, like all the others, runs just fine on 12V). The RAM
plastic mount goes for $40, the touratech aluminum mount (very trick) goes
for $90. So with the unit, the autonav kit, the power cable, and the
mount, the whole package is $580. And it's immensely useful off the bike,
whether in another car, or as a handheld. The 76C/CS go for very similar
prices, and are almost identical units in a slightly different form
factor. The buttons are on top of the screen, the case is a smidge larger,
and the whole unit floats. The screen, the processor, and the software is
identical.

As far as I can tell, a similar setup on a 276C would run about $980 ($600
for unit, $250 for auto kit, $40 for mount, $90 for 128 meg garmin card),
and a 2610 would go for $815 ($750 for unit, which includes cityselect &
128 meg card, comes with auto kit, another $25 for a bare-wire
cable, another $40 for a ram mount or $100 for Touratech).

A good friend of mine ordered both the 2610 & the 60CS for his bikes (CBR
XX & 1150GS), thinking that the screen on the 60CS would not meet his
needs. After a few weeks, he decided to sell the 2610 and is ecstaticly happy
with the 60CS. YMMV.

- Alex

Excellent post Alex. About the 60C, I would only add that in order for it to work properly on a bike, you have to purchase and install the 12V hardwire kit. For some reason, shaking the unit (even mildly) shuts it down when on battery power.

While not as robust as the 60C, another cool way to go it to use a PDA and a bluetooth gps receiver. I've got a Dell Axim X50v with the Belkin bt gps, held by the OtterBox case connected by a RAM mount. Pluses include: vga screen (good for ripped movies), built-in wi-fi (for email/browsing during trips) & bt, SD & CF slots, decent mapping s/w that holds all of US on a 1Gb SD), flexibility of Windows Mobile (MS Office, bt mouse/keyboard/etc). Minuses are total system price (~$650 w/discounts), unit delicate outside the otterbox, separate gps receiver, need to reload s/w if battery drains.

IMHO, the 60C is the sturdiest and best value; the 2610 is good for cross country (large memory) in good weather (not as rugged); the PDA/GPS is very flexible, but expensive and not as rugged as either of the above when outside its case.

Good luck, and be careful about getting the gps aquisition sickness...


http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/powint.htm

http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/axim_x50v?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs
http://www.otterbox.com/category.cfm?Category=28
http://reviews.cnet.com/GPS/4540-3490_7-30713236-3.html

Hey MSMC!

Since DV, I've found myself trying to configure those seemingly innumerable combinations of RAM mount pieces to secure both a Valentine 1 and a GPS. I don't know if it was the "Bomb Run" into Furnace Creek where the Ranger turned his Christmas Lights ON as we passed :eek: , or Alex being told that "tickets from Rangers don't count", :beatdeadh but I've decided that ECM's and GPS are necessary. The V1 is the Ultimate radar detector, but regarding the GPS I'm confused :idunno: .


I was looking at a Garmin 76CS but my PDA/iPAQ is old and the big screen, big memory, music ("oh my!") and well as a new Windows PDA seems ideal.
Is a PDA/GPS a robust-enough solution for a bike?? Also, are those "Legal Speeding" plastic weather-proof Radar Detector Boxes ($60) for the V1 worthy?

Cheers,

Scott McC

Agreed - the multi-functionality of the PDA is cool, but like the tools in a swiss army knife, it doesn't do any one thing particularly well.

One killer feature is the fact that it has the basic functionality of a PC (albeit with a tiny screen) while on the road, so you can stop at a Starbucks in Whitehorse, SD and stay in touch with the world via the internet.

During our chat on yesterday's SMR, Alex pointed out an important safety issue, which is the impracticability of using a stylus (or fingernail for that matter) to make adjustments while underway (Ben - your thoughts?). As a "set and forget" gps, it's fine, save for the fact that you need to reload the software if your battery drains while it is in use (using the Belkin s/w on an Axim X50v).

Alex's post above noted the considerations of screen size, memory expandability and ruggedness. IMO, the 60C would be the perfect device if it had expandable memory. The screen seems measly, but its high resolution and great layout make it more than adequate for my needs. The 276C addresses both the screen size and expandability issues, and is built like a tank to boot. The downsides are the hefty price and the fact that it's frickin' huge.

For music and spoken word content, I'd personally get an iPod and be done with it. Depending on what's announced today at the Apple Worldwide Developers Conf, an iPod Shuffle or Mini should be more than up to the task.

I use a Co-Pilot GPS system with my IPAQ --
total price was $299 so including reciever and software -- pretty reasonable and works well.

I takes some time to program and the memory at times gets locked. But using the IPAQ for music, mail, games and GPS seemed like a good thing to me.

Check them out on the web -- they have other options. I don't believe they sell stand alone units.

Another interesting possibility:

http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000907044452/

http://techbargains.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=7668721/search=tomtom/fd=1

Looks like neat technology, but I'd wait until Tom Tom releases this one, which is specifically designed for motorcycles:

Click Here (http://www.tomtom.com/products/product.php?ID=80&Language=4)

http://www.tomtom.com/lib/img/riderpages/img/rider_tech.jpg

Bluetooth... Yummy...

...here comes yet another one for the collection. Must...get...help...

Well, it looks like it's getting close to upgrade time. Garmin released the GPS60Cx and 60CSx. (link here (http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap60cx/)) Similar to the old 60's, with a couple of key improvements. Main one is that now it takes a microSD card (512MB card is shipping already, 1GB card is out, but evidently hard to find online right now). It also has a much more sensitive and advanced GPS chip, which can pick up a signal not only in tree cover, but also indoors in many places! cycoactive.com is selling them for $399. It would be a slamdunk, if it weren't for the new 2730... (link here (http://www.garmin.com/products/sp2730/)) That unit has a huge screen, full US onboard, XM radio built-in, XM Traffic capable, MP3 capability, touchscreen, just about everything one would want in a GPS unit for $959 (cycoactive.com). But, the 2730 doesn't have internal batteries and can't be used off the bike (without another power source). Also, the Streetpilot series, including the 2730, doesn't allow as much flexibility in saving and loading different tracks to the unit. Choices, choices....

$399? Looks like $449 at gpsnow and cycoactive, no?

And they're discontinuing the standard 60C?

My favorite by far is from technology leader AAA. It's called the M_A_P.

The price is right, they always work, they don't require much in terms of mounting hardware, you can read them on the motel commode without risking sterilization, the scale is perfect, there's lots of fascinating information, they give your brain certain things to do on the long ride, they don't direct you to the nearest Applebees, and the price is right.


The Old-Fashioned Tool

$399? Looks like $449 at gpsnow and cycoactive, no?

And they're discontinuing the standard 60C?

There are two models, the 60CSx and the 60Cx; the S stands for sensors and is typically $50 more. The sensors are a built-in electronic compass and altimeter. I prefer the C without the sensors, as the altimeter in the CS doesn't work in planes (the air pressure screws it up), while the normal C works just fine (relies on GPS for elevation). Compass is only useful if you're really worried about absolute accuracy when you're standing still and looking for a hidden geocache. The GPS (any GPS) can tell your compass direction once you start moving even just a few feet in any direction. Also, the CS models have much less battery life as you can't fully disable the extra sensors, even though there are supposed to be system settings to allow you to do just that. The 60Cx has 30 hr battery life on 2 AA's, the 60CSx has 18 hrs. I'm sure they will discontinue the 60C and CS, there is no advantage to them compared to the new X models, and the X models are already priced at what the older models have sold for for months.

My favorite by far is from technology leader AAA. It's called the M_A_P.

Luddite. For those comfortable with this century's technology, check out the attached file. It should boot right up in Google Earth if you have it installed, and shows the track I took this afternoon coming in from Heathrow to downtown London. You can zoom in on the Marriott County Hall hotel (where I'm staying). There is a huge Ferris wheel in plain view behind the hotel, my room overlooks it; I'm about 50 yards from it. You can also zoom in on the E&Y London office if you're so inclined...

There are two models, the 60CSx and the 60Cx; the S stands for sensors and is typically $50 more.

Cheerio!

the Cx model is 449 and the CSx is 499 at cycoactive.com...

London! Good show....be sure to have some fish and chips!

You're right, now cycoactive has them for $449 & $499 (which is the same as most other online retailers). When I posted it they were $50 less for both items; not sure if that was a mistake or intended as a sale for a day or two; I probably should have jumped at it (oops).

Ok GPS Guru's

I was looking at the "old" Garmon 765 ($500 loaded?) small screen & all and was excited about it as it is tough, able to be used for sailboat racing, floats, does mapping and is portable. That was until I researched the Tom-Tom Rider and any cross-use for sailing was tossed as Tom-Tom Rider was supposed to be so fantastic.... until I read it basically sucked.... especially for $1,100.

Besides my Arrow exhaust is loudish & perfect, (I wear earplugs on most rides ) my phone is not Blue Tooth and I have no interest in chatting while I ride anyway.

So, is any Tom Tom to be avoided as FLUFF? (I do NOT need a Nanny voice telling me where to go... or a NY Cabby voice, or a Tramp, or Monte Python.)

As a clarification, what GPS BRANDS and MODELS do you suggest (AKA Great Mounts, Great Wiring, No unnecessary FLUFF.)


Cheers,

Scott McC

Hard to say. TomTom seemed to have a great device with a bunch of great features, but since it has been officially released the only real reviews I've read of it had the same opinion that you read (it blows, and is certainly not worth 2 to 3 times the price of competing units). I've always had good luck with Garmin units; there are some folks that swear by Magellan, and a another manufacturer out there is Lowrance. I think the 76Cx or 76CSx would be a great device for someone wanting a unit for sailing and motorcycling; basically the 76 series are close in function to the 60 series, but they float, come with more memory standard (are now expandable with microSD cards as well), and have a slightly better basemap. For mounts, check out cycoactive.com. Both Touratech and RAM make nice motorcycling mounts for the 76C series (and many other GPS's as well). Many Garmin units, including the 60/76 series (not all, but most) can take 12V power directly, so it's a simple wiring job from any available 12V source or even just the battery itself on a bike to run straight to the unit. Cycoactive sells such a wiring kit (link here (http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/powint.htm)). As for fluff, there isn't much in the 60/76 series. Great GPS, great mapping, great software support by Garmin, and built like a tank. If you want fluff, check out the Garmin 2730... (XM radio, XM Traffic, MP3 capabilities, etc).

Luddite.

Au contraire, old bean. I think GPS is a very cool, civilization-changing technology. Will probably get one in my next cage, to give me some way to take my mind off the boredom of driving.

I just find it about as interesting to have on a bike as an airbag.

Plus, don't you always feel sorry for the pathetic wanker who can't fathom a map? It's embarassing in the way having a (male) friend who can't bench 100 pounds is. The proliferation of the GPS will relegate the traditional self-reliant skill of the True Navigator to the historical dustbin, and for that I'm sorry.

Just as I'm sorry to have hijacked this thread, mates...back to tecno-wizardry!

Tool, waxing ponderous.

The Tool does make some good points: there's a certain romance to spreading out a paper map, relishing the possibilities, choosing a path through the unknown, the creases and folds a reminder of prior adventures. Reading a map is a skill one should not be without.

I suspect for many of us using a map is actually *easier* than a GPS. It is for me, which is why I haven't purchased a good routing receiver yet. I travel on modern, marked, well-travelled paved roads, not the dunes of Dakar, so maps are more than adequate and offer some significant advantages.

That said, I'm still considering a GPS.

I like to plan my trips using a paper map. But on the road I can only remember a half dozen turns ahead at best and I hate trying to read a map while I'm riding. Programming waypoints from my map-chosen route into a GPS would allow the gizmo to remind me where to turn. It also corrects for wrong or missed turns on the fly, reducing the need to stop and re-group.

I led a few of us the wrong direction on a club ride recently because I'd forgotten the route and couldn't read the map on my tank bag fast enough. It wasn't a tragedy, but another half-dozen riders were held up when they noticed we were no longer behind them and stopped to wait.

Necessary? Not for me. But a worthwhile convenience as prices come down.

[Now I'm heading off to the gym to work on my bench press...]

I dunno. If one hasn't used a GPS on their bike for a few months and figured out how it can make their lives easier and their rides more fun, then they really just don't have enough information to make the comparison. It's like someone who has never left Kentucky saying that Europe is an awful place to visit. (might be true for London in winter, but that's beside the point).

A GPS can do many things that a map + a brain simply cannot, including calculating optimal routes on the fly (and recalculating immediately if you choose to take a different route or miss a turn), notifying you exactly how far and how long you are from the next turn and/or your destination, can locate the nearest gas/hotel/police/chinese food/you name it in seconds, and as an added bonus it can keep track of the entire route on the fly, so you can see later where exactly you went.

The map vs. GPS argument is a bit of a straw man at times, because GPS weenies like myself are rarely saying that maps are no longer necessary at times, or fun to look at and plan, etc. etc. But a GPS is actually the most important (or at least most frequently viewed and used) instrument I've got on the dashboard, whether on a bike or in a car. Vehicles are used to get from place A to place B, with varying degrees of fun along the way depending on the vehicle and the route. There isn't a better tool out there to make it easieir to get from A to B than an onboard GPS.

All good points. Like the inability to do basic math since the introduction of the calculator, my map reading skills have gone from poor to non-existent since my first gps unit came on the scene.

That said, the practical benefits have far outweighed the risk of not being able to navigate my way out of a paper bag. In addition to the handy info (like distance/time from destination), there are the potentially life-saving (directions to nearest hospital, gas station or bar) and the plain cool (like uploading gps track into Google Earth and doing a virtual ride).

All in all, I think it's worth a try, particularly if you've ever led a group of riders for a half hour in the wrong direction. :redface:

If anyone wants to try it out, I have a spare Garmin 60C available for loan. Oh, and re ...you can read them on the motel commode without risking sterilization... I think you might be mistaking it for a different battery-powered device. :biggrin:

offroute.com (http://www.offroute.com/product/view_product.asp?x_ID=148701&new=1&fromsearch=1) is letting the GPSMAP60Cx go for $450 total, including an extra 512MB card + free overnight shipping. They are also in Reno, not CA, so they charge no sales tax. That's a savings of about $75 - $100 compared to the "normal" deal right now for these things. Offroute.com also has a decent reputation online (the owner is an advrider guy).

Colin - One of my GPS60C's is for sale as soon as I get the Cx, hopefully by Friday.

For those that have ordered (or are interested in ordering) one of these new GPS's that takes a microSD card, offroute.com (http://www.offroute.com) is now selling the 1 Gig Sandisk MicroSD card for $59, and it's in stock.

Here's a mini "GPS is cool" story from last night. Ann and I made it to the Sausalito Yacht Club dinner last night. We were running short on time on the way there, so we weren't able to pick up a new prescription for Annie at the local drugstore, figuring we'd pick it up on the way home. I checked ahead of time, and confirmed that the pharmacy was open until 10 PM.

Time got away from us a little at the dinner, and finally Ann had to punch me in the arm to get us both on the bike and headed home in time to pick it up. When we got on the bike in Sausalito, I aimed the GPS towards home, and it immediately calculated my ETA at home to be 9:56 PM. As we were heading home, a bit faster than the avg bear, we were able to confirm that the ETA was going to 9:55, then 9:54, and we pulled into Milpitas right at 9:54. It took us 2 minutes to get to the pharmacy, and Ann ran in the door at 9:56, and all was well.

If we hadn't had this onboard, we could certainly have estimated whether or not we'd make it, but from 60+ miles away, over highways and backroads, the device calculated an ever-more-accurate ETA that let us both know how fast we'd have to go to get where we needed to be. Anyone found a paper map that can do that?

Amazon has the 60Cx at $374.00 with free shipping. Think Father's Day wish list...hmm :rolleyes:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000CSWHCY/ref=nosim/103-1756174-2283838?n=172282

Anyone found a paper map that can do that?

If you had more time and wanted to take the most scenic route to the pharmacy, a paper map would have demonstrated it's value! :biggrin:

In any case, after planning and pre-riding the Hacienda ride, I'm a GPS convert. I planned the route extensively in MS Streets & Trips, then reproduced it using MapSource and downloaded it into the GPS. This takes some time, as you have to carefully select waypoints to ensure the GPS routes exactly the roads you want to use. What may look OK at a a moderate "zoom level" may be a different road when you zoom in close.

It was time-consuming, but the payoff came when we pre-rode: the GPS led the way and took us on exactly the right roads, including many on which I'd never ridden. The unit told me how far it was to the next turn, so I didn't have to constantly try to figure it out myself from the paper map, and I didn't have to try to remember a couple dozen turns or try to read the text from my tankbag at 60mph.

I can now use it to lead the ride without missing any turns (frustrating for everyone) and even share the route electronically so others with GPS can use it, too.

I bought last year's model at the West Marine Spring super sale for $277 out the door. Last year it was $399. This year is the 76cx still $399.

Get on the West Marine/BoatUS mailing lists because they sharply discount electronic stuff and sell tons of it all over the world.

The 76c is waterproof. I am still learning to use it. Worked very well on the Oregon ride, even though my mount currently consists of the map case on my tank bag.

Go online for it's features. It's good for marine, road and off-road (topographical).

I have complimented it with Garmin's MetroGuide. It came with interface cable and map source mapping software. It is compatible with virtually all third party mapping software.

There are numerous accessories. I am using AA batteries which work for up to 30 hours depending on how much backlighting you use. The bike mount will likely work on handlebars. I purchased the marine mount. I plan to adapt my shelf (set up for valentine) so that I can use the marine mount on the bike and remove it for use on the boat. I like the mount because the GPS virtually locks in with button.

As I continue to go up the learning curve (i bought the vhs instruction video which is great for newbies), and our club does likewise, I believe GPS will become indispensible. The 76c and its progeny seem to be an excellent buy.

I will likely upgrade the onboard memory, although not really necessary for my use so far.

I really like the development of our maps forum using gps systems. Again the Garmin interfaces with all mapping software, so once I learn how to do it I can download everything our members put up.

Anyway, get GPS.

Hi George -

The 76C is a great unit; you will be very happy with it, and it sounds like you got it for a decent price! Wanted to add some things to your post, for the folks that haven't taken the plunge yet, and perhaps to add some info that you hadn't discovered yet. First, the memory is not expandable. It has 115 MB, and it will never have more. To get more memory into a 76C, it requires getting a new GPS.

Garmin map software for their GPS's has been quite flaky over the years. It all works great, but different model lines have different limitations that are not intuitive. All of their map products tend to load on all their units, it's just whether or not all the features work. For example, MetroGuide used to be their entire mapping software, and it used to allow routing, through version 4.0. Any version after 4.0 though, explicitly does not allow auto-routing on the GPS. If you have any version after 4.0 (which came out probably 5 years ago), when you load the maps to the GPS you should try and see if it will allow you to route to a particular address (it won't). The maps will show up fine on the screen, and you can route from town to town using the basemap built-in to the GPS, but you won't get turn-by-turn routing to a final destination. The two other Garmin mapping software packages are called CitySelect and CityNavigator (and each of those are sold in different world regions). Both allow auto-routing on the GPS unit to a specific address. For the last few versions, these two packages are actually almost identical, except CitySelect has its maps broken up into much smaller pieces, which is good for GPS's with smaller memory, as it allows you to specifically choose which areas are best for that day. CityNavigator has larger chunks, which makes it easier to choose large areas of the country, and is faster to load to a GPS with alot of memory. Rumor has it that CitySelect is on its last version now and Garmin will only update CityNavigator going forward. Seeing how it is better for their newer GPS's, and still works on their older GPS's, that's probably a fair bet. All of their current map software also has very strict licensing, and it only allows you to transfer maps to 2 GPS units, without having to buy an additional license. MetroGuide (at least the older versions), doesn't have that limitation. (MetroGuide, CitySelect, CityNavigator, and even their Topo maps all use the same shell program MapSource to load maps and info to and from the GPS; MapSource itself doesn't include any map information)

For mounting it to the bike, I think you may need to wire it up to bike power; do not assume that the AA batteries will work while on a motorcycle. The vibration of the bike causes the batteries to jump around enough that many people have power issues with the GPS (immediate shut-off, quirky behavior) until it is wired to bike power. Here are 2 detailed links that explain why:

link 1 (http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/powint.htm)
link 2 (http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/gps_batteries.html)

In my own experience, my Garmin eMap worked fine on batteries on my Bandit 1200, and was flaky on my ZX-12. My GPS60C wouldn't work at all on batteries on either my ZX-12 or Annie's Ninja 250, and needed to be hard-wired to work well. The power cable you need for the 76C is right at the top of link 1 above, for $29 or so with all you'll need.

In terms of mounts, I'm not sure if the marine mount will be strong enough for motorcycle use. To be blunt, all of the Garmin mounts are crap (cheap plastic, cheap construction, no shock/vibration protection). I caught my eMap as it was falling out of a broken Garmin bike mount early on in its career. Two proven motorcycle mounts are the RAM system and the Touratech mounts. Here are links to both:

RAM Mount (http://www.cycoactive.com/ram/ram76c.shtml)
Touratech Mount (http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/tt76c.html)

Glad you'll be able to get some use out of the Map Room on this site, the few folks that have been using it so far really enjoy it. The work that Colin put in to map our the Hacienda ride ahead of time made the entire weekend a joy for the ride leaders (and would have for anyone else who loaded the info into their own GPS).

SanDisk just released a 2 GB microSD/Transflash card. Verizon has a 60-day exclusive on the card as it works with their just-released and heavily promoted "chocolate" cell phone. Verizon is selling the chips for $99, which isn't unreasonable for 2 GB of space in that tiny package, but I'm sure the prices will come down in a few months as well.

I ordered one for my GPS60Cx, because with a 2 GB card you can fit the entire US's detailed maps at one time, so you never have to load maps again on the card until you purchase an upgrade to the next version of the mapsource data software in a year or two(compared to now, where even with 1 GB of space I find myself pushing maps down to the unit quite often as I travel around the country; pushing a full 1 GB of maps takes 2 - 3 hrs so it is a reasonably cumbersome process).

Here's a link (http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/controller?item=accessoryMart&action=viewAccessoryDetailSearch&selectedPhoneId=2426&make=LG&model=ChocolateT&accessoryId=22757&market=All) in case anyone else has a Garmin X series and wants the 2 GB card as well.

Well, looks like that 60-day story wasn't accurate; you can get the 2 GB card directly from Amazon now:

link here (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000HCGAFK/sr=1-3/qid=1156238988/ref=pd_bbs_3/102-0765506-6051366?ie=UTF8&s=electronics)

Same price, $99, but the shipping is easier to deal with; more options and cheaper pricing compared to Verizon's.

If folks happen to have one of the expandable GPS's that take microSD cards, here's a screaming deal on a 1 GB microSD ($16).

click here for link to online store (http://www.meritline.com/kingston-1gb-micro-sd-card.html)

Will that fit in the slot in the Blackberry Pearl?

Yup, works fine; I've got a 1 GB in my Pearl right now (after removing it from the GPS and stashing a 2 GB in there).

Check out GPSNOW.COM the price is 399.99 and 449.99. Don't now about the sales tax.

Have we all confused you enough yet? As you can see there are a number of good units out there and many more new units are coming out or being developed as we speak. These units are becoming alot like our phones and computers after a few years they will appear obsolete as the new versions continue to hit the market. I have been using the BMW version of the Garmin 2610. ( BMW navigator II) There are a number of these units new in the box out on the shelves at the dealers. While they usually sell for around $1,200 with the motorcycle mount for your bike, this model is being replaced by the new BMW nav III. I personally prefer the Nav II as it has more of the data info pages I like while the new Nav III does not. You may be able to get a screaming deal on one of the Nav IIs as most dealers are closing them out. The thing I like about the Nav II ( 2610) is that you can still change the memory card. The standard card that comes with the unit is 512 mb. You can put a 2ghz care in the unit and this will allow you to load the entire Mapset for North American vs. 8 and still have enough room for europe when and if you take it on an Alpine tour etc.

I have the motorcycle mount on both my RT and the new GS. It has a quick locking mechanism with a small torques tool that you can put on a spare key chain that you can carry when you travel. This keeps it secure on the bike but easy to remove at night while in your hotel room.
The things I like about this unit are it's storage capacity and larger screen as I find myself visually chanllenged at times. Trying to read the fine print on your GPS whlile going down the road can be tough.
A down side to this unit is it does not run on battery power so you must have it either on the bike or hooked up to the included AC adapter off the bike.

Good luck in your journey into GPS land.:rolleyes:

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If anyone still doesn't have one of these, they've gotten significantly cheaper. Offroute.com is selling the 60Cx's for $309.95 (link (http://www.offroute.com/search/find_accessories.asp?find=148701&offer=1)), and the 60CSx's for $344.95 (link (http://www.offroute.com/search/find_accessories.asp?find=148702&offer=1)).